Talk:Bharat Ka Bhavishya (भारत का भविष्य)

One source ("Doc X") places this book on one day, Jan 21, 1968 in Bombay on Poli & Soc but really, one cannot imagine such a day. At best this is one date of many. Various sources have from twelve to seventeen discourses in this series. It seems reasonable to suppose that there are seventeen original discourses but because of poor sound quality much has been lost and compacted into twelve chapters in the e-book, which is the nearest thing we can find to hard copy.

TOC below reflects info from two audiobook offerings. Titles line up fairly well when missing discourses are ignored. Those discourses in one but not the other were specifically noted as having poor sound quality. One of the titles missing in OW's collection is, interestingly, used as a title in the e-book, one of the few titles that appear there. (And no date and place info either, alas).

A trivium: This title also belongs to a book by Vivekananda, perhaps appropriated by Osho? -- updated doofus-9 (talk) 10:12, 12 November 2014 (PST)

osho.com audiobook 1: भारत को जवान चित्त की आवश्यकता 2: नये के लिए पुराने को गिराना आवश्यक 3: भारत की समस्याएं--कारण और निदान 4: खोज की दृष्टि 5: भारत किस आवर? 6: पुराने और नए का समन्वय 7: आध्यात्मिक दृष्टि 8: अधिनायकशाही व्यक्ति की नहीं; विचार की 9: शिक्षा और समाज 10: नारी का सहयोग 11: भीतर चाहिए शांति और बाहर चाहिए असंतोष 12: क्या भारत धार्मिक है? 13: एक नये भारत की ओर 14: मेरी करुणा बहुत शाश्वत है 15: भारत का भविष्य 16: भारत का दुर्भाग्य 17: क्या भारत को क्रांति की जरुरत है?

Osho World audiobook (?) 1. भारत को जवान चित्त की आवश्यकता 2. नए के लिए पुराने को गिराना आवश्यक 3. भारत की समस्याएं--कारण और निदान 4. खोज की दृष्टि     5. आध्यात्मिक दृष्टि 6. अधिनायकशाही व्यक्ति की नहीं, विचार की     7. भीतर चाहिए शांति, और बाहर चाहिए असंतोष 8. क्या भारत धार्मिक है? 9. एक नए भारत की ओर 10. मेरी करुणा बहुत शाश्वत है 11. भारत का भविष्य 12. भारत का दुर्भाग्य 13. क्या भारत को क्रांति की जरूरत है?

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E-book of Shailendra has the same TOC as Osho.com's, except two following titles:

5. भारत किस ओर? (here, Shailendra say the last word is correct according to o.com)

10. नारी का सहयोग (ए रेडियो टॉक बाई ओशो)

Also Shailendra states that 17th audio is missing.--DhyanAntar 14:25, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

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Dates and Places image in from Jagdish illuminates a part of the picture regarding D&P. Text version below. The inclusion of two fragmentary infobits relating to Sakshi Ki Sadhana (साक्षी की साधना) and Sakshi Ka Bodh (साक्षी का बोध) perhaps can best be viewed as a distraction. More on that below.

1 to 9: audio missing

10. Feb 14 1968 on the radio (social / women)

11. no date Rajkot GJ (Gandhi / India, Q&A)

12. no date Vile Parle, Mumbai (India / spirituality)

13. no date Juhu Rotary Club, Mumbai (social / India)

14. no date Ajol GJ (social / Gandhi)

15. no date Shanmukhananda Hall, Mumbai

16. no date New Era High School, Baroda (now called Vadodara)

17. audio missing

Note that the transliterated titles given for ch 12 and 13 (see image) resonate well with those in osho.com's audiobook.

Regarding Sakshi Ki Sadhana and Sakshi Ka Bodh, these two "series" already have a complicated relationship with each other and with other series, so this image may or may not add a further layer to all that. Perhaps the most important thing to remember here is that both the Sakshi's are "spiritual-themed talks with roots in meditation camps, while Bhavishya is decidedly social-themed, with talks not given in camps.

And the numbers associated with them, 1-8 and 9-12, carry no other info with them, so what to make of them? If, as hinted at by their inclusion here, they might be together ch 1-12 of Bhavishya, how credible might that be? The answer appears to be, "Not at all". None of the Sakshi chapter titles correspond with Bhavishya's. So, likely their appearance here is "accidental", and as such a distraction, but left here fwiw. In the interconnected world of Osho's Hindi discourses, ya never know. -- doofus-9 00:12, 3 March 2019 (UTC)

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On above table: OW has 12 audios, not 13 as stated in the table and its audios do not have titles. E-book of OW has 12 chapters too.--DhyanAntar 06:20, 29 April 2020 (UTC)

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Hindi series of talks with dates (source document), a new source of dates, lists a few single talks which are good-to-excellent candidates to fit in here:

1. "Kya Bharat Dharmik Hai, 1 talk, 30.09.68", same title as ch.12 from osho.com. Jagdish has that title in Mumbai, but no date.

2. "Bharat Ka Durbhagya, 1 talk, 1.10.68", same title as ch.16 of osho.com. Jagdish's ch 16 has no title or date but says location is Baroda.

3. "Naye Bharat Ki Aur, 1 talk, 16.08.70", almost the same title as ch.13 from osho.com, and the same title as Jagdish ch 13. place from Jagdish is Mumbai and Timeline has other talk on this date in Mumbai. The relation with Naye Bharat Ki Or (नये भारत की ओर) is unclear.

4. "Bharat Ka Bhavishya, 1 talk, 21.01.68", same title as ch.15 of osho.com. Jagdish's ch 15 has no title or date, location is Mumbai. On that date, Osho already has two other talks in Mumbai, or at least presumed other. Could be alt-titles, but neither talk seems to have a connection with Samund Samana Bund Mein (समुंद समाना बुंद में), the one which does have an alt-title relationship with Bhavishya.

5. "Kya Bharat Main, 1 talk, 29.09.68", title has no match either in osho.com or Jagdish but the date is suggestive, as both 1 and 2 above have consecutive dates and are highly likely to be part of Bhavishya.

These three dates in a row are also complemented by evening talks for the re-scheduled last four talks of Sambhog Se Samadhi Ki Or (संभोग से समाधि की ओर) (28/09/68-01/10/68), further unifying the three talks. This is at odds with Jagdish's location of Baroda for his ch 16, but ch numbers may have shifted there; we don't know for sure that his ch 16 = osho.com's ch 16. --DhyanAntar 11:36, 2 June 2020 (UTC) / doofus-9 08:58, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

media status

There are 17 audios at osho.com (15 are available??). Shailendra has 16, with #06 and #10 missing. OW has "#01 - #12". It needs to be researched what is what. --Sugit (talk) 18:52, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

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Checked, osho.com audios are:

1. 15. भारत का भविष्य = Samund Samana Bund Mein (समुंद समाना बुंद में) (Shailendra's PDF ch 2, 1971 ed. ch.3, OW audio #2) = Samund Samana Bund Mein ~ 02. It can be the talk mentioned in Hindi series of talks with dates (source document): "Bharat Ke Bhavishya, 1 talk, 21.01.68".
2. 16. भारत का दुर्भाग्य = Samund Samana Bund Mein (समुंद समाना बुंद में) (Shailendra's PDF ch 3, 1971 ed. ch.2, OW audio #3) = Samund Samana Bund Mein ~ 03

--DhyanAntar 06:20, 29 April 2020 (UTC)