Talk:Shiksha Mein Kranti (शिक्षा में क्रांति)
- This page is under construction
Current Understanding
| event | audio, OshoWorld |
audio, Osho.com |
Shailendra's PDF | Osho.com library | Oshoganga (*1) | 1980 book edition | 2005 book edition | Earlier other book edition | Dates & Places |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Naye Manushya Ke Janma Ki Disha ~ 01 | not available | 1. "Audio Not Available" | 1. नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा | 1. नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा | 1. नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा | 1. नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा | 1. नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा | Naye Manushya Ke Janma Ki Disha (नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा), 1967.03 ed. | <1967**, Babai (MP) |
| Shiksha Mein Kranti ~ 02 (*2) | not available | 2. "Audio Not Available" | 2. धर्म और विज्ञान | 2. धर्म और विज्ञान | 2. धर्म ओर विज्ञान | 2. धर्म और विज्ञान | 2. धर्म और विज्ञान | Agyat Ki Or (अज्ञात की ओर), 1967.11 and 1969.09 ed., ch.1 | 16 Jan 1967 am, Gujarat University, Ahmedabad (*2) |
| Shiksha Mein Kranti ~ 03 | not available | 3. "Audio Not Available" | 3. शिक्षा और धर्म | 3. शिक्षा और धर्म | 3. शिक्षा ओर धर्म | 3. धर्म और शिक्षा | 3. शिक्षा और धर्म | Agyat Ki Or (अज्ञात की ओर), 1967.11 and 1969.09 ed., ch.2 | 3 Mar 1967 om**, Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel University, Anand (GJ) |
| Kranti-Nad ~ 01 | #4 | 4. शिक्षक, समाज और क्रांति | 4. शिक्षक, समाज और क्रांति | 4. शिक्षक, समाज और क्रांति | 4. शिक्षक, समाज ओर क्रांति | 4. शिक्ष में क्रांति | 4. शिक्षक, समाज और क्रांति | Kranti-Nad (क्रान्ति-नाद), 1973 ed., ch.1 | 1967, place unknown |
| Kranti-Nad ~ 02 | not available | 5. "Audio Not Available" | 5. प्रेम-विवाह और बच्चे | 5. प्रेम-विवाह और बच्चे | 5. प्रेम-विवाह ओर बच्चे | 5. प्रेम-विवाह और बच्चे | 5. प्रेम-विवाह और बच्चे | Kranti-Nad (क्रान्ति-नाद), 1973 ed., ch.2 | unknown |
| Kranti-Nad ~ 03 | #6 | 6. युक्रांद क्या है? | 6. युक्रांद क्या है? | 6. युक्रांद क्या है? | 6. युक्रांद क्या है | 6. युक्रान्द क्या है | 6. युक्रांद क्या है? | Kranti-Nad (क्रान्ति-नाद), 1973 ed., ch.3 | unknown |
| Kranti-Nad ~ 04 | #7 | 7. नारी और क्रांति | 7. नारी और क्रांति | 7. नारी और क्रांति | 7. नारी और क्रांति | 7. नारी और क्रांति | 7. नारी और क्रांति | Kranti-Nad (क्रान्ति-नाद), 1973 ed., ch.4 | unknown |
| Agyat Ke Nae Aayam ~ 01 | not available | 8. "Audio Not Available" | 8. अज्ञात के नये आयाम in the end: "A Q&A discussion from the pre-published "Agyat Ke Nae Aayam" booklet: 1968-69" |
8. अज्ञात के नये आयाम | 8. अज्ञान के नये आयाम | 8. अज्ञात के नये आयाम | 8. अज्ञात के नये आयाम | Agyat Ke Nae Aayam (अज्ञात के नए आयाम), 1973.07 ed. | unknown |
| not available | 9. "Audio Not Available" | 9. प्रेम-केन्द्रित शिक्षा in the end: "A discourse among students on the topic "Youth and revolution": 1968-69" |
9. प्रेम-केंद्रित शिक्षा | 9. प्रेम-केंद्रित शिक्षा | 9. शिक्षा : प्रेम-केन्द्रित | 9. प्रेम-केन्द्रित शिक्षा | |||
| #10 | 10. विषबुझी महत्वाकांक्षा | 10. विषबुझी महत्वाकांक्षा in the end: "On "Education and Ambition" between Principal and Teachers New Era High School, Baroda: 10 January 1968" |
10. विषबुझी महत्वाकांक्षा | 10. विषबुझी महतवाकांक्षा | 10. शिक्षा : विषबुझी महत्त्वाकांक्षा | 10. विषबुझी महत्त्वाकांक्षा | |||
| #11 | 11. अशांति का बीजमंत्र | 11. अशांति का बीजमंत्र in the end: "On the topic of "That is the only knowledge which makes (one) free", Birla Sports Center, Bombay: 23 September 1968" |
11. अशांति का बीजमंत्र | 11. अशांति का बीजमंत्र | 11. शिक्षा : अशांति का बीजमन्त्र | 11. अशांति का बीजमंत्र | |||
| #12 | 12. विद्रोह की आग | 12. विद्रोह की आग in the end: "On "Birth of New India" among teachers" |
12. विद्रोह की आग | 12. विद्रोह की आग | 12. शिक्षा : विद्रोह की आग | 12. विद्रोह की आग | |||
| #13 | 13. संदेह की ज्योति | 13. संदेह की ज्योति in the end: "Address to students" |
13. संदेह की ज्योति | 13. संदेह की ज्योति | 13. शिक्षा : सन्देह की ज्योत | 13. संदेह की ज्योति | |||
| #14 (*3) | 14. साध्य और साधन (*3) | 14. साध्य और साधन in the end: "Q&A Series-1 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
14. साध्य और साधन | 14. साध्य ओर साधन | 14. शिक्षा : साध्य और साधन | 14. साध्य और साधन | |||
| #15 (*3) | 15. बोध से रूपांतरण (*3) | 15. बोध से रूपांतरण in the end: "Q&A Series-2 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
15. बोध से रूपांतरण | 15. अखंड जीवन का सूत्र (this is title for 16th chapter in all other sources) |
15. बोध से रूपांतरण | ||||
| #16 (*3) | 16. अखंड जीवन का सूत्र (*3) | 16. अखंड जीवन का सूत्र in the end: "Q&A Series-3 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
16. अखंड जीवन का सूत्र | 16. (no title) | 16. अखंड जीवन का सूत्र | ||||
| #17 (*3) | 17. जटिल धारणाएं नहीं, सरल जीवंत अनुभव (*3) | 17. जटिल धारणायें नहीं, सरल जीवंत अनुभव in the end: "Q&A Series-4 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
17. जटिल धारणाएं नहीं, सरल जीवंत अनुभव | 17. महत्वाकांक्षा रहित अतुलनीय प्रेम (this is title for 18th chapter in all other sources) |
17. जटिल धारणायें नहीं, सरल जीवंत अनुभव | ||||
| #18 (*3) | 18. महत्वाकांक्षारहित अतुलनीय प्रेम (*3) | 18. महत्त्वाकांक्षारहित अतुलनीय प्रेम in the end: "Q&A Series-5 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
18. महत्वाकांक्षा रहित अतुलनीय प्रेम | 18. निराग्रही, अन्वेषक चित्त की खोज (this is title for 19th chapter in all other sources) |
18. महत्त्वाकांक्षारहित अतुलनीय प्रेम | ||||
| #19 (*3) incomplete |
19. निराग्रही, अन्वेषक चित्त की खोज (*3) incomplete |
19. निराग्रही, अन्वेषक चित्त की खोज incomplete in the end: "Q&A Series-6 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
19. निराग्रही, अन्वेषक चित्त की खोज incomplete |
19. (no title) incomplete |
19. निराग्रही, अन्वेषक चित्त की खोज incomplete? |
||||
| #20 (*3) | 20. जीवन-विरोधों में लयबद्धता का बिंदु (*3) | 20. जीवन-विरोधों में लयबद्धता का बिन्दु in the end: "Q&A Series-7 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
20. जीवन-विरोधों में लयबद्धता का बिंदु | 20. जीवन-विरोधों में लयवद्धता का बिंदु | 20. जीवन-विरोधों में लयबद्धता का बिन्दु | ||||
| #21 (*3) | 21. मनुष्य के आमूल रूपांतरण की प्रक्रिया (*3) | 21. मनुष्य के आमूल रूपांतरण की प्रक्रिया in the end: "Q&A Series-8 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
21. मनुष्य के आमूल रूपांतरण की प्रक्रिया | 21. मनुष्य के आमूल रूपांतरण की पक्रिया | 21. मनुष्य के आमूल रूपांतरण की प्रक्रिया | ||||
| #22 (*3) | 22. मनोविश्लेषण, मनोजागरण और मनोसाधना (*3) | 22. मनोविश्लेषण, मनोजागरण और मनोसाधना in the end: "Q&A Series-9 on "Education: Means and Measures"" |
22. मनोविश्लेषण, मनोजागरण और मनोसाधना | 22. मनोविश्लेषण, मनोजागरण ओर मनोसाधना | 22. मनोविश्लेषण, मनोजागरण और मनोसाधना | ||||
| #23 | 23. नारी की मुक्ति और शांति | 23. नारी की मुक्ति और शांति in the end: "Discourse on "Women and Peace"" |
23. नारी की मुक्ति और शांति | 23. नारी की मुक्ति और शांति | 15. शिक्षा : नारी की मुक्ति | 23. नारी की मुक्ति और शांति | |||
| Purva Ka Dharm ~ 01 | #24 | 24. अंधविश्वासों से मुक्ति | 24. अंधविश्वासों से मुक्ति in the end: "Discourse in front of youth" |
24. अंधविश्वासों से मुक्ति | 24. अंधविश्वासों से मुक्ति | 16. शिक्षा : अन्ध-विश्वासों से मुक्ति | 24. अंधविश्वासों से मुक्ति | Purva Ka Dharm: Paschim Ka Vigyan (पूर्व का धर्म : पश्चिम का विज्ञान), 1970.09 ed. | late 60s, place unknown |
| Shiksha Mein Kranti ~ 25 | #25 | 25. शक्ति-नियोजन | 25. शक्ति-नियोजन | 25. शक्ति-नियोजन | 25. शक्ति-नियोजन | 17. शिक्षा : शक्ति-नियोजन | 25. शक्ति-नियोजन | 25 Dec 1969 am, Ahmedabad (*4) | |
| #26 | 26. शिक्षकों की खोज | 26. जीवंत शिक्षकों की खोज | 26. जीवंत शिक्षकों की खोज | 26. जीवंत शिक्षकों की खोज | 18. शिक्षा : जीवन्त शिक्षकों की खोज | 26. शिक्षकों की खोज | |||
| #27 | 27. अंकुरित होने की कला | 27. अंकुरित होने की कला | 27. अंकुरित होने की कला | 27. अंकुरित होने की कला | 19. शिक्षा : अंकुरित होने की कला | 27. अंकुरित होने की कला | |||
| #28 | 28. कम्यून-जीवन | 28. कम्यून-जीवन | 28. कम्यून-जीवन | 28. कम्यून जीवन | 20. शिक्षा : कम्यून-जीवन | 28. कम्यून-जीवन | |||
| #29 | 29. नई दिशा, नया बोध | 29. नई दिशा, नया बोध | 29. नई दिशा, नया बोध | 29. नई दिशा, नया बोध | 21. शिक्षा : नयी दिशा, नया बोध | 29. नयी दिशा, नया बोध | |||
| not available | 30. बोध का जागरण incomplete: available only 23 min of the middle of talk |
30. बोध का जागरण | 30. बोध का जागरण | 30. बोध का जागरण | 22. शिक्षा : बोध का जागरण | 30. बोध का जागरण | |||
| Shiksha Mein Kranti ~ 31 | Vigyan Dharam Aur Kala #11 | 31. "Audio Not Available". Also as Vigyan, Dharm Aur Kala 10. नया मनुष्य |
31. शिक्षाः नया धर्म | 31. शिक्षा: नया धर्म | 31. शिक्षा: नया धर्म | 23. शिक्षा : नया धर्म | 31. शिक्षा : नया धर्म | 10 Aug 1970, Ahmedabad (*5) |
(*1) Oshoganga texts have the same notes in ends of chapters as in Shailendra's PDFs.
(*2) Available as manuscript Manuscripts ~ Vigyan Aur Dharma (विज्ञान और धर्म). Source of date is Manuscripts ~ Reports.
(*3) At least first question is in English. Osho's responses are in Hindi.
(*4) Source of date/place is Shailendra.
(*5) Source of date is Hindi series of talks with dates (source document) that says "Bisvi Sadi Naye Manushya Ke Janm Ki Sadi, 1 talk, 10.08.70". This is first sentence of this event. Source for location is Timeline (several concurrent events in Ahmedabad).
Deliberations
About the five constituent shorter series said to make up Shiksha Mein Kranti, the source for this info is not impeccable but still may be credible. While searching for Naye Manushya Ke Janma Ki Disha, i found only two solid references (more on that there) plus a guy selling audios, and expounding on Shiksha and its parts. Audios for that series were not found anywhere else, at least under that name.
Some confirmation would be nice but information reaching that far back is a thin stream, so we may have to be patient. FWIW, "Doc X" lists four of the five sub-series (as themselves), leaving out only Naye Manushya. But for the "shorter" Shiksha Mein Kranti alone, it has 22 chapters, and a combined discourse count of 23 for the other three brings us already to 45, way over the top, so this avenue does not seem very promising.
Nor is enlightenment to be found looking at the discourse titles, below. Two of the constituents show up there, as discourses one and three, there are a couple of resemblances for two of the others, and a tantalizing Nari Aur Kranti but no reason to believe that its relationship to Shiksha is anything more than general thematic resonance. And even a cross-checking of Naye Bharat's chapter titles (not done earlier) has turned up no correspondences.
- No relation in text with Nari Aur Kranti (नारी और क्रान्ति) (6 talks) and Naye Bharat Ka Janm (नये भारत का जन्म) found.--DhyanAntar 13:38, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
About the editions: The Diamond edition, at only 200 pages (or 197 per some sources), is not likely the whole original text. The TOC suggests only eight chapters, though some amalgamation and condensation may have taken place. In fact, in Revolution in Education, there are nine chapters, so it looks like shifting and merging happens with this book. And fwiw, one of those chapters is called Towards the Birth of a New Man, exactly a translation of Naye Manushya Ke Janma Ki Disha, so some confirmation is drifting in re the constituent series.
About dates and numbers of discourses: Assuming (for now) the five-component model for Shiksha, we have dribs and drabs of info of varying quality from many places. Putting it all together in a coherent picture would be too much to expect, so we'll settle for a very incomplete and not entirely consistent picture.
One of the most incomplete aspects of this picture concerns Shiksha the component. Almost nothing is known about it, though there may be fragments, eg Neeten's Osho Source Book reports a manuscript written by Osho in 1968 called "Education, Teacher and Society" and subtitled "Thoughtprovoking Lecture for a Group of Teachers of Bombay" which, alas, does not correspond to any of our titles below but could easily be in the original Shiksha series. Neeten also reports Shiksha as a 28-talk series with talks in the years 1967-1969. There are 31 in our (larger) version here. Neeten is perhaps not counting a few like Naye Manushya from 1962ish (he has in any case counted it in that context). And so it goes.
- This manuscript is Manuscripts ~ Vigyan Aur Dharma (विज्ञान और धर्म), which first published in Agyat Ki Or (अज्ञात की ओर) as ch.1 in Nov 1967. So it is not possible that the manuscript written in 1968.--DhyanAntar 13:38, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
FWIW, osho.com lists 31 audios for the larger Shisksha as well, but only 24 are are available and having titles (and several of them having parts missing or other sound problems). The missing chapters -- so perhaps audio for them never existed? -- are #1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 9 and 31. Osho World hasn't an audiobook but in its free downloads offers 22 talks.
So how many talks might there be in Shiksha the component? That can only be guessed / inferred by subtracting all the other components from 31. And it's not like they are well known. See what i mean? Anyway, proceeding on into this nebulosity, best guesses for the other slightly better known suspected components are Agyat 7, Naye Manushya 1, Naye Bharat 11 and Dharm 5, which leaves seven for Shiksha the component. And so that shall be our best guess, perhaps with a 5% chance of being right? -- updated doofus-9 (talk) 18:18, 20 April 2015 (UTC)
प्रवचन (TOC):
|
प्रवचन (TOC cont'd):
|
Just some info: OshoWorld has #4, #6, #7 and #10 - #28 in "High Quality" mp3, and had earlier #1 - #29 in "Low Quality".
In LQ, #1 - #28 have corresponding content cf. the HQ; LQ's #1-3, 5 and 8-9 have no sound. So LQ only adds #29. --Sugit (talk) 15:56, 25 September 2015 (UTC). Updated: --Sugit (talk) 05:27, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
And more stray info: Ch 29 here also turns out to have the same title as a chapter in Nav-Sannyas Kya? (नव-संन्यास क्या?). It is probably more likely that they are unrelated, just two talks having coincidentally the same title. It happens. If they are related or the same, an interesting question arises as to which one came first and is the source for the other. Shiksha is not the only series searching for its roots; Nav-Sannyas is also in that boat. Given the relative time frames of each though, it is more likely that Shiksha is a (partial) source for Nav-Sannyas rather than the reverse, if either is the case. -- doofus-9 06:51, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
- No relation found in text of ch.29 with Nav-Sannyas Kya?--DhyanAntar 13:55, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
And revisiting the audiobook places, OW and o.com (which have discourse titles to go with their offerings), we find a great similarity between their titles and those of the book. This is not all that common. The only difference found was in the spelling of nayi/nai in ch 29, where OW has नयी instead of नई. And the missing chapters/discourses are 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 9. and 31 fwiw, with OW additionally missing #30. nbd -- doofus-9 21:12, 19 March 2017 (UTC)
"Subtitle repair" done on the basis of info received from Shailendra. Previously subtitles were created from trying to read from the low-medium-res OMI cover image, with less than 100% accuracy. Xtra-low-res 2002 Rebel cover image still too low-res to guarantee the same subtitle but felt to be a reasonable supposition. -- doofus-9 20:16, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
1989 edition was added on the basis of appearing in a list of upcoming titles published in March 1989. Text explaining the ins and outs of the story involved can be found at Talk:Hindi Subtitles – A Story. Shiksha's subtitle plays a significant part in the article connected with that talk page. -- doofus-9 02:10, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
TOC of Shailendra's e-book is almost the same, except:
- - ch.1: नये मनुष्य के जन्म की दिशा
- - ch.26: जीवंत शिक्षकों की खोज
--DhyanAntar 04:47, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
Revolution in Education has lots of very concrete dates and places, so seems to refer to real events.
I think we should try to find how this book and that translation combine. In Talk:Revolution in Education I have given it a try. Maybe it is also possible to Google-tranlate the book and compare that with Revolution. (This comparing has now been done by Antar,see Talk:Revolution in Education) --Sugit (talk) 17:59, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
No text-relation found with Shiksha Aur Dharm (शिक्षा और धर्म) and Samyak Shiksha (सम्यक शिक्षा).--DhyanAntar 03:14, 17 May 2020 (UTC)
It is unclear what chapter meant in Hindi series of talks with dates (source document) among 3 talks in period 23-25 Dec 1969:
- Manushya Ek Ajayabghar 1
- Naye Manushya Ki... 2
- Shiksha Main Kranti [sic] 3 (date 25 Dec 1969 is confirmed by Shailendra (as 25th talk), he also gave place - Ahmedabad. As Osho was in there at least from morning of 23 Dec to night 26th, then all three should be in Ahmedabad)
This list also says: "Shiksha, 3 talks, from 17.01.70".--DhyanAntar 16:33, 2 June 2020 (UTC)
Shailendra - Osho's Hindi books (source document): "31 talks, 1966-1970"--DhyanAntar 10:18, 16 June 2020 (UTC)
Renaming of events
The publishing destiny of first 8 chapters are clear now, i compared texts (by using Shailendra's PDF) and chapter titles of booklets. Much help was from TOC of RF edition.
Related 8 events to these chapters will be removed or renamed, except two events Shiksha Mein Kranti ~ 02 and ~ 03 because we do not know what Agyt Ki Or events match to them: 2 chapters published at first there, which corresponding to Shiksha's 2nd and 3rd ch., but there are 7 audios and it is unclear what chapters are in events. See Talk:Agyat Ki Or (अज्ञात की ओर).--DhyanAntar 05:16, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
- Updated: it seems they are completely another events as they have greetings and one of them is available in manuscript form. For detailes see above link.--DhyanAntar 12:06, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
