Talk:Naye Bharat Ki Khoj (नये भारत की खोज)
- This page is under construction
Current Understanding
| event | audio, OshoWorld |
audio, Osho.com (*1) |
2012 book edition (*1) | Shailendra's PDF | Oshoganga | Dates & Places |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| #1 | 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद | 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद | 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद | 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद 4 May 1969 morning, Poona |
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| #2 | 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा | 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा | 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा | 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा 4 May 1969 night, Poona |
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| #3 | 3. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद | 4. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद | 3. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद | 3. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद 5 May 1969 morning, Poona |
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| #4 | 4. असली और नकली का फर्क | 4. असली और नकली का फर्क | 4. (no title, no date stated) | |||
| #5 | 5. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद | 3. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद | 5. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद | 5. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद 6 May 1969 morning, Poona |
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| #6 | 6. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ | 5. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ | 6. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ | 6. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ 6 May 1969 night, Poona |
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| #7 beginning incomplete |
7. कुछ और | 7. कुछ और | 7. कुछ और beginning incomplete |
7. (no title) beginning incomplete 6 May 1969, Poona |
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| Dekh Kabira Roya ~ 15 | Dekh Kabira Roya #15 missing beginning and at least first half of last question |
Dekh Kabira Roya 7. भौतिक समृद्धि: अध्यात्म का आधार missing beginning and at least first half of last question |
6. अच्छे लोग और अहित |
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5 May 1970, Nargol |
Note: the series is not available in osho.com library.
- (*1) This source compared on the basis of their titles only, while other sources compared by their contents (text).
Deliberations
- 2014
Nothing much to add except some amusing bits found in the e-book version. At the beginning of each chapter is the following:
टक्स गिवन इन पुना इंदिया
दिस्कोर्स नं०
This transliterates -- not translates -- to:
"taksa givana ina Puna India
Diskorsa nan0", followed by a Devanagari numeral corresponding to the chapter number.
Then at the very end: वाचक--सारा मुल्क ऐसा है । हमारा माईड ऐसा है . . . Which translates to "Reader - the whole country is like that. Our maid is like that . . ." -- Sarlo (talk) 13:58, 29 July 2014 (PDT)
- Audiobook TOC's
2014, from Osho World: - 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद ==> 1
- 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा ==> 2
- 3. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद ==> 5
- 4. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद ==> 3
- 5. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ ==> 6
- 6. अच्छे लोग और अहित not in o.com
- 7. कुछ और ==> 7
2017, from o.com: - 1. आत्मघाती पलायनवाद ==> 1
- 2. वैज्ञानिक चिंतन की हवा ==> 2
- 3. आत्मघाती परंपरावाद ==> 4
- 4. असली और नकली का फर्क not in OW
- 5. आत्मघाती आदर्शवाद ==> 3
- 6. हिंसक राजनीतिज्ञ ==> 5
- 7. कुछ और ==> 7
In 2014, only the e-book and OW's audiobook were looked at. In 2017, the story has got more complex. Osho.com also has an audiobook offering of seven mp3's for this series and the kicker is that they are not all the same as OW's. The order is different and there is one title in each not found in the other.
This last fact is actually a blessing since it enables a correction of the total number of talks from seven to eight. In fact, o.com says there are eight but the eighth is unavailable. Well there it is, over at OW. How cool is that!? -- doofus-9 09:02, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
First 7 titles in Shailendra's e-book are the same as o.com's version + ch.8 अच्छे लोग और अहित.
There is chapter 8? O.com 8th audio mentioned as 'not available'. Shailendra's e-book has text of this chapter, which almost dublicates ch.15 (of 30) of Dekh Kabira Roya (देख कबीरा रोया) : except first question and first line of answer to it. Chapter title of Dekh Kabira Roya is different.--DhyanAntar 08:04, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
The list "Hindi-Diamond" from Shailendra states on existing an earlier edition before Diamond one.--DhyanAntar 17:28, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
Last Diamond edition, which presented in wiki with image of pub info, is unknown year. It looks as reprint more early Diamond edition. We do not have contents of this edition, but what it is interesting is mentioning about "original book is Kahai Kabir Diwana (कहै कबीर दीवाना), ch.1-5. Is this so?--DhyanAntar 08:45, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
Extracts from Shailendra's PDFs (with rough translation):
- ch.1: ends by "Hence the first sutra: Life is real; Body is real; The substance is real. All the problems of life are real. And those who say that life is illusion, they say wrong, because they do not show the way to solve life. Arrange to get drunk in life, drink opium. And till we ask these people, till the talent of India will be asked by the monks, then India has been defeated again and again, defeated again and again, miserable again and again. Gaya, the bet is going to be paid even further. We do not have to ask the sage, not the people who have run away from life, the scientific talent that has emerged in the struggle of life, what is the solution? What is the solution? And if she is not a genius, we will have to produce her. That talent is born, how can it be, I will talk to you on those sources tomorrow morning and day after tomorrow. Whatever questions you have in this regard, you will give them in writing, so that evening can be said."
- ch.2: q/a. Starts by "Many questions have been asked regarding the morning discussion." In the end: "And questions remain, I will talk tomorrow. Tomorrow morning I will also talk on the sources of the day after tomorrow. Questions related to them will be discussed in their morning sources."
- ch.3: in the end: "This is the second sutra: the one who is bound by archaic is a fake man. One who is bound by the past is afraid. And a scared man can never be real, authentic, authentic. The soul of India is no longer authentic, it is not authentic, it has become unnatural. And then the second as much unnaturalness has been born, it is born from this. And until this basic illiteracy is not erased, then no other illiteracy can be erased, because it is its by-product, it has come from her. Tomorrow morning I will talk to you on the third thread."
- ch.4: q/a. Starts by "A friend has asked: In the morning I said, all men are fake, those friends have asked who is fake? Who is real? How do we recognize?" IN the end: "Based on these few questions, I said something. There are some more questions left, I will talk about them tomorrow evening. Tomorrow morning, I will talk on the final thread that where there is a problem in stopping India's problems and its talent, where is the stone, where is the wall."
- ch.5: starts by "In the last two days, I have talked about India's problems and our talent, some things in this regard. On the first sutra on the first day, I said that India's talent has remained undeveloped, due to migration, escapism. We have learned to escape and escape from life, not to live life. And those who run away can never solve life's problems. Running is not a solution. Turning back from problems and closing your eyes is not a solution. It is only to deny the problems, to call it false, to call it illusion, to close one's eyes from problems, but in this way there is no freedom from problems. The mind is relieved that there are no problems, but the problems survive, they are. And problems cause as much damage as they can cause. And the problem that remains unsolved, it becomes a lump of wounds and disease in the brain, it becomes a complex. And India has accumulated so much problems in its history that man has been buried under them, as if buried under a mountain.
- "The other day I said that the second thing has become an obstacle in the development of India's talent and that is traditionalism, traditionalism. The Conservative mind always looks backwards, it does not have eyes on the front. Problems come from the front and solutions to the traditionalist mind come from behind. Problems always come from the front and solutions always come from behind. They do not have any coordination. There is no relation in him. Solutions continue to gather together, problems continue to gather together. And a miracle happens - we are overwhelmed by the burden of problems and also by the burden of solutions. Problems are also damaging India's talent and solutions learned like India's parrots are also being harmed. If solutions are found, and they do not match the problems, then those solutions become a hindrance in finding new solutions. And we get the illusion that we know the solution. India has developed the illusion of being knowledgeable and hence India cannot be knowledgeable, it is not possible. We have stayed in our ignorance, because the illusion of being knowledgeable has been created.
- "Let me make this clear with a short story and then talk to you on the third thread."
- ...
- "In the third sutra, I want to tell you, whatever society will be idealistic, that society will rot, it will die, that society cannot grow. There should be a realistic society. Talent is developed through the path of realism, not through the path of idealism. He who is an idealist, talks about the sky and the problems are of the land. And his words sound very good. But they belong to the sky. And the solution is needed on earth, and it has nothing to do with the earth."
- in the end: "In these three days, in these three sutras, from exodus, from tradition and from ideal, I asked to be freed from these three. If these three stones are removed, then the source of India's talent is freed, he started running towards India's Sarita Sagar. But if these three stones stop the sarita of India's talent, then we have become a puddle, who does not run, does not walk, does not reach anywhere. Rotting, rotting, dirt goes on growing, disease goes on growing. Sickness, wounds go on and on, pus goes on collecting, foul smell keeps on spreading. And we close all our eyes, Maya, Maya; Lies, lies; Close your eyes and keep searching for satisfaction. It cannot be with this satisfaction, this stream will have to be broken, it will have to be oriented towards the ocean, so that one day man rises from the animal and reaches the divine.
- "The temple of God is near, but forgetting the animal, not by lying; By knowing the animal, identifying it. From transcendence, from his encroachment. And knowledge is the way to transcendence. Knowing is the method of transcendence, of transcendence. Ignorance is suicide. Knowledge is self-revolution."
- ch.6: q/a. Starts by "Based on the discussions of these three days, many questions have been asked by friends."
- ch.7: q/a, can be intimate or informal talk.
- ch.8: q/a. Also intimate talk?
(in progress)
