Talk:Prem Ke Swar (प्रेम के स्वर)

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Prem Ke Swar(2) 1974 pub-info.jpg

On the title page opposite the pub info (image right, click to enlarge), there is a mysterious description of the book -- भगवान् श्री द्वारा कपिल-कुसुम को लिखे गये २७ पत्रों का संकलन -- which indicates that there are only 27 letters, not 68. Will inquire. -- doofus-9 17:05, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Shailendra throws some light:

"Prem Ke Swar - was originally a small booklet of 27 letters only, written to Kapil & Kusum. Now the plan is to add all the unpublished letters in upcoming edition. First 27 letters are written to Kapil and Kusum, Rest (28-68) are written to Ma Yoga Sohan, Ma Prem Urmila, Shree Deriya Ji and other seekers."--DhyanAntar 17:37, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Ma Prem Urmila, shouldn't that be Ma Anand Urmila? --Sugit (talk) 11:33, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Ha! That didn't take long. In fact, this makes the mysterious middle part, "to Kapil-Kusum", clearer too. Dhanyavaad! (Possibly he meant Ma Anand Urmila?) -- doofus-9 18:57, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Facsimiles of the manuscripts have surfaced, see correspondence 20-10-2018 6:48UTC "Letter to Kapil & Kusum (31)". --Sugit (talk) 09:28, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Why is that not first edition?--DhyanAntar 09:22, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

It seems letter 18 (in above correspondence under titles "Letter to Kapil & Kusum (20)A" and B) is incomplete in the book: missing P.S. on second sheet (back).

The same case with letter 10 (i can't say what titles of these two images in correspondence as i renamed them already): P.S. on back sheet is not found in the book, i.e. unpublished.

Dates from manuscripts, other info from pdf:

1) 25.04.1969 to Kusum
2) 02.07.1969 to Kusum, mentions Chandigarh dates Aug 3-5 changed to Ludhiana
3) 07.08.1969 to Kapil, date not found in pdf. One is suspicious because letters 3 and 4 have the same date here, though the theme of both suggests that is a real possibility, or very close in time. That date DOES appear in the pdf for letter #4. 1974 edition of the book confirmes that two letters have the same date.
4) 07.08.1969 to Kusum
5) 24.08.1969 to Kusum, mentions returning from Gujarat, and will fly from Delhi to Srinagar Sep 17 midday
6) 30.08.1969 to Kusum
7) 07.09.1969 to Kusum, missing in Shailendra's PDF
8) 23.10.1969 to Kusum, date not found in pdf
9) 03.11.1969 to Kusum
10) 19.11.1969 to Kusum
11) (no date in manuscript; Shailendra PDF - 29.11.1969) to Kusum
12) 02.12.1969 to Kusum, mentions Jan 16-19 satsang in Bhavnagar
13) 16.02.1970 to Kusum
14) 08.04.1970 to Kusum
15) 25.04.1970 to Kusum
16) 01.05.1970 to Kusum
17) 13.05.1970 to Kusum
18) 17.05.1970 to Kusum
19) 10.06.1970 to Kusum
20) 29.06.1970* to Kusum
21) 17.11.1970 to Kusum
22) 26.11.1970 to Kusum
23) 16.01.1971 to Kusum
24) 25.02.1971 to Kusum
25) 07.03.1971 to Kusum
26) 08.03.1971 to Kusum
27) 13.03.1971 to Kusum
* Date of Letter 20: manuscript - 29.06.1970 (under title "Letter to Kapil & Kusum (22)"), Shailendra's PDF - 26.06.1970m which is the typo. Date 29.06.1970 confirmed by 1974 edition of the book.

Ch 28-32 much longer, undated, unaddressed, may not be letters. Most other dates above confirmed by Shailendra's PDF. Below are the rest of the dates from the PDF (only found there) plus other info extracted:

28) can be found as sheets 1-3 of Manuscripts ~ Punruddhar (पुनरुद्धार)
29) can be found as sheets 4-5 of Manuscripts ~ Punruddhar (पुनरुद्धार)
30) unidentified
31) can be found as sheets 6-7 of Manuscripts ~ Punruddhar (पुनरुद्धार)
32) can be found as sheets 23-27 of Manuscripts ~ Jeevan Sampada Ka Adhikar (जीवन सम्पदा का अधिकार)


33) 30.08.1966 to Sohan, mentions Sep 14 as earliest possible time in Pune, apparently written from Jabalpur. Manuscript is Letter written on 30 Aug 1966.
34) 27.08.1966 to Sohan, mentions having been in Nepanagar (MP) and going to Indore Sep 2. Manuscript is Letter written on 27 Aug 1966
35) unidentified
36) 08.07.1965 om to Sohan, manuscript is Letter written on 8 Jul 1965 om
37) 11.07.1965 to Sohan, written from Kareli (MP), will speak there that night. Manusript is Letter written on 11 Jul 1965
38) 08.09.1963 pm to Sundarlal, likely not Lala Sundarlal Jain, written from Indore, mentions a visit to Jalgaon (MH) set for 21-22 Sep
39) 03.12.1963 om to unknown
40) 08.03.1971 to Girdhar Bhai Ukani (Sw Akshay Yogeshwar), Rajkot
41) 16.06.1963 am to Hariram ji Aasaliya
42) 08.04.1970 to Girdharbhai Ukani (Sw Akshay Yogeshwar), Rajkot
43) 12.01.1966 om first contact letter to Urmila, location Yogesh Bhavan, Jabalpur, mentions leaving for Surat Jan 23, returning Jan 27
44) missing
45) 08.10.1966 to Urmila, location probably Jabalpur
46) 11.10.1966 am to Urmila, location probably Jabalpur, mentions going to Aurangabad today, ret Oct 16, going to Matheran Oct 21, ret Oct 30
47) 27.05.1967 to Urmila (Osho was in that time in Gadarwara)
48) 19.06.1967 to Urmila, location Jabalpur, mentions he will be there Jul 2-9 and 14-21
49) 17.07.1967 to Urmila, location probably Jabalpur
50) 10.09.1967 to Urmila's husband RG?
51) 08.12.1967 to Urmila, location probably Jabalpur, mentions coming to Pune in Mar.
52) 24.02.1971 to Urmila, location probably Bombay. On wiki as Pad Ghunghru Bandh ~ 099
53) 22.11.1969 to Bharati, location possibly Bombay (JJK Bombay letterhead). Kumari Bharati Ishwarbhai Shah, London ?
54) 30.05.1970 to Bharati. On wiki as Antarveena ~ 020, addressee: Kumari Bharati Ishwarbhai Shah, 55 Hamilton Street, London
55) 21.07.1970 to Bharati re birthday. Kumari Bharati Ishwarbhai Shah, London ?
56) 23.09.1957 to Deriya Ji, location Sanskrit College Raipur, mentions coming "home" (to Jabalpur) Oct 5-6. See manuscript Letter written on 23 Sep 1957
57) ??.07.1957 to Deriya Ji, likely location is Sagar (mentioned in text, also using SK Saksena's letterhead) also mentions a recent letter from Gadarwara, appears to be #59, giving this one an approx date ~5~15 Jul. See manuscript Letter written on ?? Jul 1957
58) 29.01.1960 to Deriya Ji, location is Jabalpur. See manuscript Letter written on 29 Jan 1960
59) 05.07.1957 to Deriya Ji, location is Gadarwara, mentions having been in Pachmarhi (MP) and going soon to Sagar. See manuscript Letter written on 5 Jul 1957
60) 03.03.1960 to Deriya Ji, mentions coming to Itarsi (MP) Mar 10. See manuscript Letter written on 3 Mar 1960
61) 15.08.1957 to Deriya Ji, location is Gadarwara. See manuscript Letter written on 15 Aug 1957
62) 19.01.1960 to Deriya Ji, location is Jabalpur. See manuscript Letter written on 19 Jan 1960
63) 31.08.1960 to Deriya Ji, location is Jabalpur, mentions having come back from Bombay, Pune and Uruli Kanchan (MH) Aug 28, will go "again" to Vidisha (MP) Sep 2-3, hoping to arrange something at Wardha (MH)††. See manuscript Letter written on 31 Aug 1960. Although the Shailendra PDF gives incorrect date 21 Aug 1960.
64) 06.09.1960 to Deriya Ji, location is likely Jabalpur, mentions having just returned from Vidisha, so events there Sep 2 or 3-5, Wardha now arranged for Sep 10 to ? See manuscript Letter written on 6 Sep 1960
65) 25.02.1963 to Deriya Ji, mentions upcoming event in Delhi, centers in "Bombay, Calcutta, Jaipur, Kanpur, Udaipur, Chanda and other places". See manuscript Letter written on 25 Feb 1963
66) 10.08.1963 am to Babulal Deriya Ji "Swarajyanand", mentions upcoming events in Bombay Aug 22-23, Indore before that, Bhopal after. See manuscript Letter written on 10 Aug 1963 am
67) 10.09.1965 to Deriya Ji, mentions receiving a book by an author named Kanji. See manuscript Letter written on 10 Sep 1965 (Deriya)
68) 25.09.1968 to Deriya Ji. Theme of the letter relates to Deriya Ji's recovery from a significant illness. See manuscript Letter written on 25 Sep 1968

There are also stated a few places. Sarlo, if you will have some time, please look at them in the PDF.--DhyanAntar 17:02, 25 September 2019 (UTC)

†† = We have a date conundrum here. A transcription of the letter is dated Aug 21, while he talks about just returning from Bombay on Aug 28 and leaving soon on Sep 2. What is most believable is a mis-transcription, since the Devanagari numerals 1 and 9 are fairly similar, १ and ९ respectively. Or Osho could have mis-written a 9 as a 1. Aug 29 would make much more sense, so the date has been altered here from 21.08 to 29.08. An alternative possibility, though less likely, would be Aug 31. Both the 29th and 31st are possible with one simple error. -- doofus-9 07:23, 29 September 2019 (UTC)
  Update: An image of the letter and its postmark has now made it clear that it is Aug 31, not 21 or 29. -- 06:55, 5 October 2019 (UTC)

The Move

Prior to now there has been some unclarity concerning the title of this book; specifically, it was thought that there were two books using the same title. This book of letters was designated Prem Ke Swar (प्रेम के स्वर) (2) and the presumed other Prem Ke Swar (प्रेम के स्वर). In the Notes for the other, it was said, "There are two new (previously unlisted) Hindi books with this title, a book of letters and this one, said to be 'written' by Ma Anand Urmila. 'Written' is presumably in the same sense that she is the writer of Shanti Ki Khoj (शांति की खोज) (discourses), ie she is transcribing from memory what Osho has said. In Shanti Ki Khoj, her reportage was validated by Osho; the same standard is presumed here. In fact the cover says nothing about her, with the author being indicated as Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh".

In fact, the supposed cover, pub info and contents pages for that (non-existent) book were the same as this book, same pub date, even the same obscure printer in Varanasi, so it is no wonder that the author was indicated as Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh. I have searched the net today for any evidence that could justify this two-book idea and was unable to find any, so the other will be retired and this book moved to take its rightful place. -- doofus-9 05:59, 21 October 2018 (UTC)